Let's Talk About Friendship Breakups

Transcript

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Well, hey everybody, and welcome back to Qualified, the place where incredible people share their stories of overcoming great adversity and loss to inspire you and give you hope.

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I'm Michelle Heaton.

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Relationships can be tough.

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You might still be friends with the people you met in high school.

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You might have moved away and have all new friends that you've made in your new job or in your new neighborhood, or you might be one of those people who does a great job at keeping in touch with all the old ones and the new ones, being careful to remember all their kids' names, their interests, their special days, and if you're one of those people, my hat is off to you.

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Maintaining friendships can be hard work, especially when life gets busy and you fail to stay in touch the way you should.

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But throw in miscommunication, rumors, politics or religion and you have a whole host of reasons to have conflict in a relationship.

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So what do you do when this happens?

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Do you jump in and try and fix things, or do you let the relationship sort of fizzle out?

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And what about the friend that lets you know that it's time for the relationship to end?

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That doesn't feel good.

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What then?

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Well, my guest today has written a book on this very topic, called when Best Friends Aren't Forever.

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In it, she explores the challenging journey of overcoming the pain of a friendship breakup through a faith-filled lens.

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It's a heartfelt four-week guide rich in biblical wisdom and healing activities, all crafted to guide women from hurt to healing, with a focus on finding peace by pursuing spiritual growth and healthier relationships.

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In addition to being a writer, she's a longtime Texan who lives in the Dallas area with her husband and two sons.

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Her name is Kristen Reed Belveal and it's my pleasure to have her as my guest on the show today.

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Welcome to Qualified Kristen.

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Thanks, I'm so excited to be here

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Hey, let's start off by talking about why you decided to write a book on friendship breakups.

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Can you give us a background?

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one of them, like I've learned different things, like I had one when I was a lot younger, like I want to say maybe like 22 or something, and then as recent as maybe like four years ago, and each time it's like, hey, there can be a better way to process this, you can work towards forgiveness, you can work towards healing.

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You don't have to

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stay bitter.

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And I realized you know there are so many books out there about like finding your community, building friendships, and then a lot of stuff about like dating and relationships and breakups and things like that.

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But there's that awkward spot of like, okay, I had friends and now it's over.

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That I felt like was a bit overlooked in the book market, especially for Christians, in the book market, especially for Christians.

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So I wanted to write something that could help other people walk through that season faithfully and to grow as Christians and experience sanctification, to forgive in a biblical way and find healing, and also not increase the damage to the relationship, because even if you're not friends anymore, you're still human.

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There's still some sort of relating.

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So that's why

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Wow, that's great

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Yeah, I think there probably is a real need for that, just based on my own experience.

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So let's talk about the fact that sometimes in relationships, it's either an argument or words that are left unsaid, or something that causes kind of a tension between two friends when you sense that one of them is maybe angry.

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How do you go about trying to approach, you know, to reconcile with somebody when they are angry?

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Yeah, I think that just being intentional and communicating is the most important thing.

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Like if someone is either talking to you or you just get that sense, like through an argument or a social media post, because we all know that can be a thing these days, you know, going to that person directly, going to them one on one and saying like hey, when you were saying this, it seemed like you were angry with me.

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Or just make it a question, like that might make them a little less defensive, and ask like hey, is there something that I've done that's upset you recently?

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Or hey, were you upset about that topic or were you upset with me about how I was handling it?

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And just kind of going from there and just being very humble because we are all sinners Like even people have been Christians for a really long time like even they still have sin, and just like, hey, there are things that I've done imperfectly and I care about this person and I care about our friendship.

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So I'm willing to enter into the difficult conversation and even hear something difficult about, like the way I behaved, for the sake of preserving things.

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Yeah, yeah, that's really good, and I think, if the reality is that the person tells you it was something you said and they're truly hurt by it, and maybe in their heart it's something that's unforgivable, or it just hurts too much for now, when the friendship is over and the other person is trying to process that loss, what are your thoughts on best ways to do that?

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I think one of the really important things is to make sure you have the right people around you, that you're processing it with.

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I know that their culture can be really easy like both online and in person to hear a lot of kind of like you go, girl.

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Like they hurt you, that didn't serve you, so let it go, kind of messaging that it might seem really empowering on the surface but it's actually kind of like keeping you in prison to the sin that, on your end, led to the friendship breaking down.

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So it's really important to have, like your friendship breakup team Like that's one of the first days within when best friends aren't forever is identifying a group of godly, mature women who are willing to comfort you, to speak truth to you, to even call you out lovingly on the things that you didn't do well and could do better in the future, and who aren't afraid of hurting your feelings in a holy way I guess that's one way to put it because those are the people that can really help you off through this journey well and who can also keep your conversations focused on healing and processing, versus venting and gossiping, because there is a lot of temptation to like try to control the narrative, to make yourself seem like a good guy and things like that, when really it's like hey, like maybe you don't need to talk to people about this period, like you don't need to make a big social media post, you don't need to, like let every single person you know know that, hey, I'm not friends with this person anymore, just so so you know, and it's all their fault.

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It's like, hey, what is the right way to talk about it without hurting that other person?

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So having that godly group of people around you who you can process things with and who can have constructive conversations with you is really important.

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Yeah, yeah, I love the advice of godly mature mentor types because we do need that.

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We need kind of a guidepost, somebody to tell us you know, hey, this is the next level of maturity, you.

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But I think sometimes when we do go through any type of loss, we think about what we did wrong to contribute to it.

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And even though you're kind of on the other side and giving advice, were there times that you struggled like right after the loss?

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What kind of emotions did you process during that time?

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I think for me, like one situation in particular, something that came up a lot was like you know, what could I have done better?

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Like should I have reached out more?

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Should I have done this differently?

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Should I have communicated to this person in a specific way and I'm trying not to go into details because you know, like I talk about in the book, like there's a right way and there's a healthy way to talk about things, and I don't want to like make things awkward for people, but like there was a lot of just kind of like looking through, like what I had done and just kind of feeling guilty about not doing things better.

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And, on one hand, like it's good to recognize like hey, I am whatever percent at fault in this situation that like keeps you from having progress.

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So I think one of the things is like hey, if you're looking back on something that you did wrong, something you wish you had done better, or just like, hey, if I had known this other thing I would have done differently is to kind of think through like hey, how can this help me be a better friend in the future and in the present, versus just dwelling on what happened with it in the past and also praying through like hey, now that I've thought about this and I've realized these things that I did wrong or could have done better, like does it make sense to reach out to this person, does it make sense to have a conversation or do I just need to let it go and do better going forward?

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I think that's one of the really important things, because we're all humans.

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We're all broken people, so we are undoubtedly going to realize things we didn't do well, but dwelling on it in a way that helps you be a better person is a lot different from just beating yourself up about it.

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Yeah, thank you.

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That's great and I'm big on, you know, in the podcast learning, learning from the losses, learning from what we did, and we'll talk about the lessons in the end and save that for last.

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But can you just give like one example of how you've decided based on your experience, how you've decided to kind of shape your relationships in a new way, going forward, to avoid that?

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Yeah, so one of the friendships that I've had in the past that did not work out, like there was a lot of leaning on each other too much in a way that wasn't healthy.

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And you know, some people might say that it was codependent I'm not a therapist so I don't throw that word out there but like that's a way that like people have seen it, and something that I realized was like, hey, I don't need a specific person to lean on for all of these different things.

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It's like, hey, and I don't need to be somebody's like rescuer either.

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It's like, hey, if somebody needs a lot of handholding, like I can love them by pointing them to Jesus and, you know, trusting that that's going to work out, and praying for like how I should intervene instead of just always intervening out, and praying for like how I should intervene instead of just always intervening.

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And then on the flip side, it's like, hey, I don't need to put all of my relational need eggs in one basket, you know.

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You know God is our father, he gives us everything that we need and he is ultimately the person that is going to give us all of our comfort, all of our identity, all of those things.

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So it's like, hey, there is a healthy way to lean on other people that is interdependent, without being codependent, and also not being so independent that you act like you don't need any friends or anybody.

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So just realizing like, hey, the people that are in my life, like I am not their savior, they are not my savior, and just kind of adjusting the expectations, like even in marriage, like I am not their savior, they are not my savior.

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And just kind of adjusting the expectations, like even in marriage, like if I put all of my hopes and dreams and expectations on my husband, like he would crumble under that weight, right, right, and I love him so much but he's not Jesus, even though he's supposed to love me like Jesus.

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So so, yeah, just giving the appropriate weight to relationships has been a big lesson for me.

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I love it.

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That's very, very good.

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I'm thinking about the fact that you're a Christian and your book is faith-based, and that's a big factor in relationships, and you've mentioned, you know, giving it up to God, and I think that's huge too.

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So what role did faith play in your experience, in both the loss portion and the reconciliation process?

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Yeah, so I'll start with the reconciliation.

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So for me, a lot of it is just around the fact that, like, we are supposed to forgive as God has forgiven us, and a big part of that is like forgiveness and reconciliation are two different things.

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So I always have to work on like, hey, I'm going to forgive this person before they do anything different, because that's how God forgave me.

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I think it's Romans 5.8 that says God shows his love for us and that while we are still sinners, christ died for us.

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And then when we think about our journeys as Christians, like we believe in Jesus, then we repent and we are sanctified, like we don't believe in immediately, like we're way better people or we don't work our way, and then it's like, okay, now you can have your salvation and then go the rest of the way, so just realizing that like hey, I am forgiving that person, like this moment, but we both need to forgive and we both need to own whatever we need to own and change for this to really be like a good godly friendship again, instead of just going back into like, oh well, let's just forget that and go back to how we were before, because there's still going to be that seed or root of unhealthiness there.

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So really focusing on, like that three-part process of like the forgiveness, repentance and reconciliation is big, and then in terms of like the forgiveness, repentance and reconciliation is big.

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And then in terms of like when things were happening, I think prayer is such a huge thing, just like constantly praying and even using like, instead of looking at scripture to kind of rebuke the other person.

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It's like, hey, is there scripture I can find that can kind of rebuke me in this situation.

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Like, what are some things that, like I am doing wrong by God's?

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Like?

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Hey, is there scripture I can find that can kind of rebuke me in this situation?

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Like, what are some things that, like I am doing wrong by God's standards, even if the world would say that it's okay?

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And how can I like come to the table and own those things so that, no matter what happens, like I have a clear conscience about how I've handled it and I can move forward being a healthier, more godly person as a result?

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So yeah, prayer and looking at scripture as a sanctifying tool for yourself instead of as a weapon against somebody else, I think the big thing.

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Yeah, that's huge.

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I love that you brought that in, because prayer brings us to the place that we need to be with God.

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Sometimes it just keeps us in check.

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When we ask God to help us with that, you know, sometimes, I think, when we ask God to help us with that, you know, sometimes I think, when we're in a relationship whether it's a new one or if it's one that we've had for a long time sometimes we just get a vibe.

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We just get a sense that something's not right or they're treating us different, or maybe something's wrong.

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When you start to sense that your relationship is weakening, or what have you done in the past to kind of resolve it or help it, not end?

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Yeah, I think reaching out is a big one.

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Like there are times when, like you know, I haven't seen this person in a long time and they seem like they're struggling, or I get a sense that they might want to connect or they might be disappointed that we're not connecting as much, and I'll try to find time to talk to them.

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You know whether it's like, hey, we're both super busy, let's just grab a quick coffee, let's go get mani pedis together, whatever that looks like, and just finding time to really talk about whatever's going on, because sometimes the vibe you're getting has nothing to do with you.

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And if you take that on yourself and you're like, oh, she's mad at me or he's mad at me or whatever that is, then like you can kind of swirl in an unhealthy way of like just wondering and wondering and wondering and feeling really bad about it, or you kind of get defensive and you turn it around on them and, before you know it, like something that was not a friendship issue at all on their end is a friendship issue on your end, because you've let that bitterness come into your heart.

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So yeah, I think the biggest thing is like reaching out, connecting, seeing how things are, because sometimes if you just invite the person out to coffee to get your nails done whatever that looks like to a movie then like you'll just naturally find out what's going on, they might say like hey, I'm so glad you reached out.

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I've really been missing you, or man, I've had you on my mind and like I've been struggling because of X, y, z, or it might just be nothing, it might have had nothing to do with you, it could be work, it could be their family, it could be their health.

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You just don't know, but reaching out is always a good option.

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Yeah, I think, in friendships, marriage relationships, any relationships, I think communication is huge, isn't it?

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To making things, yeah, to fixing it.

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So, all of that said, you've offered so many good things, kind of along the way, with each question you've given, you know, practical tips and spiritual tips.

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But can you kind of summarize some of the big lessons that you've learned, having been through a friendship breakup or two, that you can share with somebody listening who might be actually right now in the midst of that, with someone that will give them hope?

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Yeah.

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So, of course, like looking for people that will sharpen you like iron, like Proverbs 27, 9 and 17,.

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Both talk about, like you know, iron, sharpening iron and friendships and like sometimes these situations are sharpening for you, like the actual conversations with the friend that you're having issues with.

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Sometimes you get that sharpening from your BFF breakup team.

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But like looking at the whole situation through the lens of the gospel, that, like I'm an imperfect person, I need forgiveness.

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I am not the person that I'm going to be in eternity.

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So that helps you approach it with humility, both with the person that you're in conflict with and with the people you're processing with.

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Also just forgiving.

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As Christ forgave you, so forgive before the person even changes, before they even reach out to you, and knowing that, like hey, when you forgive them, you're not saying that what they did was okay, you're just trusting God to deal with their sin.

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And when God deals with it, it's with wrath or mercy, you know, and like as Christians we get to experience that mercy and grace.

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So like hoping that that's what that person experiences.

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So if they are following Christ, like hey, you know that's the situation, like God has forgiven them, like they're going to go to heaven all the great things If they don't know Christ, like praying for their salvation, is a really important thing because even if you guys reconcile, like if they're not reconciled with God, like that is the worst schism to have in a relationship.

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And then even just like being mindful about the content you're taking in online you know we have social media these days and it is a great tool, but it can also be really damaging.

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It can just Kristen keep reaffirming what you're thinking because of how the algorithm works.

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So you might have to do the work of taking the apps off your phone for a season.

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That could be the most extreme thing you do.

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Or it could be tailoring the algorithm where it's like whenever something comes that inspires bitterness, that tailoring the algorithm where it's like whenever something comes that inspires bitterness, that inspires self-hatred, that inspire entitlement.

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Hide it, unfollow that account.

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Hide it.

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Unfollow that account and then hopefully it will stop showing you those things, or at least show it even less, and make sure that you're interacting with things that are actually like good, spiritual, christian content, because it'll show you that more, of course, like we should be getting our spiritual enrichment in ways other than scrolling and swiping and double tapping, but knowing that that's such a big part of life, we do need to take that into account when working through difficult relationships.

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Thank you, kristen.

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Those are great lessons and good reminders for all of us to remember to apply the Word of God forgive first, pray for our friends and manage what we're taking in Good stuff.

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So, since your book looks at how to manage friendships from a biblical perspective, was there any particular scripture or story in the Bible that stands out in your mind as kind of a model for us to follow?

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So something else that was a really big inspiration for this book that I would encourage people to look at in the Bible is the story of Paul, barnabas and John Mark.

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So Paul and Barnabas were going to be going on a missionary journey in the book of Acts I believe it's Acts 15, and Barnabas wanted to bring John Mark with him.

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But they had a book right there and decided to go their separate ways because Paul had seen John Mark abandon them I want to say at Camp Celia I might be fake mispronouncing that city's name so they went their separate ways.

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Paul went to one area to preach the gospel, barnabas and John Mark did something different.

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But then, when we get to 2 Timothy 4, when Paul is near the end of his life I believe he's in a Roman prison at that point he gets executed not long after he asks for John Mark because he was useful to him and to me.

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That is so beautiful because we see that these people who are like giants in the faith, like so many people, have children who are named after these free men.

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They had this really big friendship breakup on a missionary journey and one God still used them Like.

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There's a reason we still know who all these people are and it's because they did really amazing things in Jesus's name before and after that moment and they had this big breakup.

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But at least Paul and John Mark came back together.

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So we have this example of reconciliation.

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We can see a relationship being healed.

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We don't see it happen, but we see the results of it at that point.

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But we also don't see Paul and Barnabas interacting and we don't see that that was a reconciled situation and that's a difficult one, because it could be that they reconciled and it's just not captured in the pages of scripture or it could be that it didn't happen for some reason.

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But it's interesting because we can see that, like you know, whether you do the hard work of working on yourself, trying to pursue reconciliation, forgiving, repenting, all of those things, like it's not in your control if the other person does the same and God can work in you and he can use you whether you reconcile or not.

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But it's so important to do that work in your own heart, with your own faith, to become a better person and to be more like Christ.

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That way, like in the future, if you run into that person, like you can be prepared to meet them with love and compassion and knowing like, hey, I have prayed for you for the past three years since we stopped being friends and I haven't reached out because I didn't feel like that was the right thing, but you've been on my mind and I want good for you and I hope you've had good in this time that we've been apart.

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Good for you and I hope you've had good in this time that we've been apart and that, whether they react to that with love or indifference or spite, like you always have God, you're never alone, no matter what happens, and God will provide you with the people, with the friends, with the family that you need to walk faithfully in your life.

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So that is a big thing that inspired this book.

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I wanted to encourage people with Wow, I love that.

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That's a lot of wisdom right there.

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You know it's truth and you're right, scripture does paint that picture for us, Apolothreadics and so we need to keep factoring in what God wants and stop taking things into our own strength, and that was kind of what I was hearing as you were talking.

00:22:47.825 --> 00:22:50.772
So thank you so much for that, kristen.

00:22:50.772 --> 00:22:59.636
I wanted to mention your website so that people can go there and get a copy of your book, and I noticed when I was there you're not just writing books, you also have your hands on a few other projects.

00:22:59.636 --> 00:23:02.634
Can you just take a minute and tell us about what else you're up to?

00:23:04.025 --> 00:23:09.853
A funny thing that I'm working on now that people might find interesting is I just started my own clothing line called Apolithetics.

00:23:10.012 --> 00:23:20.713
So people are looking for interesting Christian related clothing like not just like goofy t-shirts, because there are some addresses even that have like hidden Christian messaging in them.

00:23:20.713 --> 00:23:23.567
The sweatshirt I'm wearing is from the clothing line.

00:23:23.567 --> 00:23:26.213
It has like a houndstooth inspired cross on it.

00:23:26.213 --> 00:23:30.412
So just a lot of clothes like that, even stuff for men and kids too.

00:23:30.412 --> 00:23:34.451
So, if you like, not just sharing your faith with your words, but with your fashion.

00:23:34.551 --> 00:23:38.313
That's my latest project well, thank you for that.

00:23:38.313 --> 00:23:43.067
I love the sweatshirt Apolothreadics looking forward to checking out apolithetics and see what else is there.

00:23:43.067 --> 00:23:48.968
So I'll put a link to your website in the show notes so listeners can go there and find you easily.

00:23:48.968 --> 00:23:51.131
And you you're on Instagram too, right.

00:23:52.053 --> 00:23:56.480
Yes, if you find me on Instagram, it's the easiest way to find Apollo Grettings.

00:24:00.790 --> 00:24:02.837
And my Instagram is just Kristen Reed TX.

00:24:02.837 --> 00:24:03.420
Great Thank you.

00:24:03.420 --> 00:24:04.707
Well, hey, I just want to say thanks so much.

00:24:04.707 --> 00:24:10.598
This has been a pleasure meeting you and talking about friendships and the way God wants us to deal with the friendships in our lives.

00:24:10.598 --> 00:24:13.074
So thank you again for agreeing to come on the show.

00:24:14.164 --> 00:24:15.611
Thank you for having me, it's been great.

00:24:17.385 --> 00:24:26.536
So, for those of you listening, I don't know what you took away from listening to Kristen, but I sure learned a lot about viewing friendships through the lens of faith.

00:24:26.536 --> 00:24:42.179
I love what Kristen shared with us about surrounding ourselves with a mature group of believers will help us work on our issues and how we might have contributed to the problem, versus only hanging with those who will tell us how great we are and what we want to hear.

00:24:42.179 --> 00:24:53.026
And the reminder to keep our conversations with that group focused on healing and processing, versus venting and gossiping Another good pearl of wisdom right there.

00:24:53.026 --> 00:25:00.007
So if you're struggling with a friendship right now, I hope you were encouraged today by what Kristen shared.

00:25:00.007 --> 00:25:11.000
And all losses in life, all adversity, can be used to help other people if we learn from it and if we take the time to share our stories with others.

00:25:11.000 --> 00:25:19.470
So hang in there, my friend, and look for the lessons in your struggle and the opportunities to walk with someone else in their pain.

00:25:19.470 --> 00:25:21.175
Thanks for listening.

Let's Talk About Friendship Breakups

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