What my son’s death taught me about life

Michelle:  Well, hey everybody, and welcome back to Qualified - the place where incredible people share their stories of overcoming great adversity and loss to inspire you and give you hope.  I'm Michelle Heaton.  With me today is another mom who has a story to tell about the loss of her child. She of course endured incredible pain and sorrow in those early months and years, following his passing, but because of the love and support of her family and friends and a deeply-rooted faith, she has emerged with lessons that can benefit us all.

Welcome to Qualified Mary!

 Mary:  Thank you for having me, Michelle. 

 Michelle:  In previous episodes, I've talked with two other bereaved parents who shared about the emotions associated with the sudden death of their children. But today we'll talk about receiving a terminal diagnosis for your child and the impact that it has on a mother and a family. Today, we'll talk about your son, Nathanael and how when he was 24 years old, he was diagnosed with a rare illness, known as germ cell cancer. He went through surgery and rounds of chemo and doctors believed that he had beat it. And then later you all learned that his cancer had returned. Mary, what was it like for you to receive that news, and then only to have a week to spend with Nate before he passed away? 

 Mary: I was devastated. I was in shock. I was angry. I mean, just so much of a gamut of emotions because we watched him endure Chemo every day, we watched him, you know, rebound from that have surgery rebound from that only to find out that the cancer came back and very aggressively.

 Michelle: Well, we know that everybody copes with loss in different ways. How much time did you spend in that deep grief after he passed away? And can you tell us about some of those feelings that were so hard to get through back then? 

 Mary:  I don't know. I don't think grief ever leaves. I mean, I think you go through different stages of grief, but for myself it literally took me almost 10 years to get the full joy back into my life. I mean, there were spots and of course you, you hang on to all the memories you hang on to all the pictures, you know, we would get together every anniversary of his birthday, every anniversary of his death and, and just relish in the fact. And I mean, then you do come to a point where you begin to be thankful. Thank you, God, that I had twenty-five years with my son. Thank you for allowing me to be his mom. Thank you. That he had a close relationship with his other siblings and, Nate was just very witty and loyal and you know, if he touched your life, it's something that you're going to always remember.

  Michelle:  As a mom losing a child, did you ever look back over his life and experience any feelings of regret? And how did you deal with that? 

 Mary: I don't, I don't think there was a lot of regret as far as, you know, raising the kids. I think, you know, as a mom, you always think, you probably should have, put the dishes aside and played with them more and that kind of thing. But the only regret I really have is when Nate ended up back in the hospital and, I was still working at the time. And I worked for a large corporation that really didn't know how to treat their employees other than the aspect of a number. And Nate ended up back in the hospital and he was, he was very sick. He went in with septic. And after them treating him for there for like a day and a half, he, you know, he called me and, he said they want to intubate me. What should I do? And I said, well, Nate don't even go there. You'll, you'll be fine.  And I said, don't be afraid. I'll get there as soon as I can. And what I should have done at that point is just leave work. But when you're working for a place that would threaten your job or not work with you, as far as overriding time off for vacation, I mean, you do what you have to do. So, I stayed. And that that's my biggest regret. I should've just left work then and went to be with my son because when I did finally get to the hospital, he was intubated it and he never came out of it.  I never got to speak to him or where he was able to respond back to us. So that was, you know, and I still, I mean, yes, your job is important, but your family should be more important. 

 Michelle: I know I experienced some of that too.    I beat myself up a little bit about the things I wish I had done, you know, spent more time, and work too, for me working full time and having him come home and kind of be a latchkey kid, and I guess I just wished that I had more time, but you know, work got in the way. 

 Mary: Well, we always wish for more time. 

 Michelle: So, you said that Nate knew his condition was terminal and those last days, and I know the time you spent at his bedside was incredibly hard, but so important. So how did you manage during those visits? And what words did you say in an attempt to show him love?

 Mary:  I think just being present. You know, and just, I don’t know, I think it's almost like you get a, a shroud of something covering you. I don't know if it's shock. I don't know if it's denial, but you just kind of, I mean, even in that state, I didn't think he was going to die. Even in that state. I just thought he's going to rebound and he'll be okay. And he'll be back home. So. You know, some of my thoughts were just, you know, hanging on to a piece here and he's going to be okay. And he, he, he was for some time, but the cancer just got him in the end.

 Michelle:  You told me about a scripture from the Old Testament in Ecclesiastes Chapter Seven that had deep meaning for you. Can you talk about what those verses and the significance?

Mary: Well, I'm going to, I'm going to go back because right after Nate passed, I, I was looking through, you know, the Bible is very important to me and I was looking at. And to the Bible for like an answer, you know, why did this happen? Show me something Lord. And this was probably the fifth year of his death, where I was, you know, just doing some daily reading and it's first seven verse one where it talks about better is the day of a man's death than the day of his birth. And I just got this excitement to know that my son, even though in the flesh, he's dead, he's not.  He's with my Lord and savior. And one day I'm going to see him again, one day we'll be able to be together again. And that just brought a spark, a hope in me that I didn't have for those first five years. So, it just brought a little bit back into my heart of, of joy and you know, this is going to be okay. And this will eventually be okay. 

 Michelle: Yeah. You know that the scripture goes on to say something like it's better, the better to spend time at funerals than at parties. You know, it just kind of elaborates on that. And I remember when I interviewed pastor Jeff in a previous episode, He was talking about how he officiates at weddings and funerals. And he said, at weddings, he'll stand up there and he’s, giving a message along with the ceremony. And he said, nobody's listening. Cause all they can think about is the cake and the booze and the reception and the honeymoon, you know, but he said at funerals, he has everyone's undivided attention. And so, I think that's, that's what that scripture means. Is it deeply meaningful? the day you die is better than the day you were born. That's what it's all about. I mean, I I've been to funerals where people call them celebrations of life and they're actually dancing and worshiping because they know that their loved one is going to a better place.

 Mary: Right. So, and I agree with that, but at the same time, you kind of wonder, we know that's true. And we know we'll have that reconciliation, but why do we grieve so much? Why do we, you know, why does our heart just break? And yeah. Yeah. It's, you know, I know, I believe in heaven, but at the same time, why do I still grieve for my, my son? You know? So those are a couple of the why questions that I probably will never get an answer for until I'm reunited with them. 

 Michelle: Yeah, I feel the same way. I think we always, we have that heaven knowledge, but we're always going to miss him, going to miss him, you know, walking through the door. 

 Was there anyone else in your family that had a really difficult time with it? 

 Mary: His brother, I mean, they were best friends. Sean spent every night at the hospital with Nate

Michelle: And how's he doing now? 

Mary: I mean, he's doing good. In fact, the funny thing is he not the funny thing, but he got COVID so he's kind of quarantined. And he sent a picture to me and his sister's. He went to the cemetery to visit Nate. And he says I'm able to hang out with somebody I can’t infect, and you know, it just brought a little spark of happiness to us in a sense,  

 Michelle: So, can you think of any incredible things that have happened, that have come as a result of his passing?

 Mary:  I'm not afraid to die anymore. I used to be very fearful of dying and what was going to happen. And I think we all do, because we don't know how, but I'm not afraid of that anymore.

 Michelle: What changed? 

 Mary: Just partly that scripture we went over and apparently, you know, our faith is that, you know, even though we die, we have eternal life. And I think, I mean, what you mentioned is, I mean, it's in your brokenness where you draw near to God and he draws near to you. Right. And I think it's in our desperation, you know, and I was desperate to see my son whole and I was desperate to see my son healed.   Back in 1979, I was involved in a car accident and which I broke my neck., it was cervical C four and five, and, we had just recently moved. So, they were getting ready to transport me after being three days and ICU. And somebody came to ICU and said that you were there to pray for me. And my husband was there at the time and they let him know. And the guy, it was a pastor from a local church. Never knew him to this day. I don't know who he is, but he prayed and just spoke the word that I would have a slow and gradual healing and be bound to Christ the rest of my days. Wow. And after. You know, three-month rehab. I had a halo cast. They wanted to operate. They didn't need to, and I've been fine since, so I always believed in the power of prayer and the power of healing. So, I just assumed that when my son got sick, he'd be healed too. And he wasn't. 

 Michelle:   So, what are your thoughts about that? 

 Mary: Well, I've had, I've had years to process a lot.  But I think the biggest is I was angry at God? And then I wanted to deny, I know I pulled back for a lot of years and I wanted to deny that healing existed, but I couldn't because it happened to me. So, it's I don’t know, I was angry. I was. Upset. I mean, what do you, do you feel helpless? You want to take it on yourself as the parent? And when that didn't happen, I mean, you function. I had a function, I had other children at home. I was helped taking care of my mother. So, you just kind of muddle through life. 

  Michelle:  So, you said it took 10 years, right?  10 years.  And for some people I know in the last episode that woman, I talked to Christine, she said it was two years before she finally felt joy again. And as she was saying that in my mind, I was thinking it's more like five for me., and you said 10, everyone's different. I have a friend. Who asked me how long it took until we cleaned out Sean's room? And that was a very big deal for me. So, what were those 10 years like?

 Mary:  Well, I think, I mean, your grief is always there. I don't think it, it just, you go through different depths of it, you know, and as well as different healing steps and Nate died around the holidays. The holidays have always been very, very special to us and our kids and, you know, just the whole joyous thing of Christmas and presents. And, and I didn't have that. I didn't have that up until the 10th year, we happened to be up in the central coast and went to a, Christmas market and all it was. With just Christmas lights and Ray brought it out and he said, Mary, your face is glowing. Your joy is back. And I realized then it was, and I don't know. I mean, like I said, the, the years, I mean the years tend to help in your healing. 

 Michelle: You said Ray said your joy is back. So how did your marriage hold out during, I mean, was it strengthened? Was it stressed? 

 Mary:  It was strengthened. It brought us closer. Okay. Which is a blessing in itself because you know, you can look at statistics and that is, could be a cause of people, divorcing because they grieve different. I remember reading one time that, you know, as you carry a baby, their DNA. Inside of you as well. So, I think that's a connection that a mother has that a father doesn't. 

 Michelle:  I remember feeling, just so many things physically afterwards, I thought at one point I was having a heart attack. I felt like somebody had in those first days and nights, I felt like somebody had their hand around my heart and was squeezing it. I just, I remember my husband told me why don't you go and get a massage you need to relax. I was causing myself real physical problems with blood pressure and everything because of it. And so, I remember this masseuse that we've known for a long time. She knew what happened with Sean and she made a comment similar to what you just said. And I said, I don't understand my body. And she said, you don't understand? And she said with a mother it's cellular and I just went like a light went on. Yeah, of course it is. We carried them in our bodies and it's like, having your arm amputated.  

 Mary:  That's so true. But I do remember one time it was probably, I always liked organization and organizing and putz around is like healing therapy to me.  And I remember probably about, probably about a month to two months after Nate passed, I was in just straightening my closet and I felt like. Something just kicked me and that the grief was just got wrenching. I'm ever looking for Ray. I remember looking for my mom, I just needed a hug. I just couldn't figure out. I mean, like I says, I, you just function, you just function. Cause you know, that's what you have to do. Yeah. 

 Michelle: In the beginning., it was so surreal for me. And I just felt like I had this anesthesia or something that had to be divine because I felt like there's no way this really happened. It's sort of a denial obviously, but I felt like if I was allowed to really experience the full reality of it, I couldn't bear it. And so, God, I believe took that from. I refer to it as divine anesthesia, because that's how it felt. But there would be moments when all of a sudden, I felt like the veil just got lifted and I got to see what really happened. And it would just hit me, like you just described and I would just lose it. And then I have to bring myself back around to the realization that he's in heaven with God. And he's. And I had dreams. I had a lot of dreams.  

 Mary: I had dreams. I remember one dream and I can't put a pinpoint on the day, but I remember Nate coming over to me and kissing me on the forehead and said, mom I'm okay. And they had to edit another layer of healing. You know, I think I, I think you have to give yourself as much time as you need and. Each little thing, we'll just take another layer of that grief. Another layer of little, you know, little bits of healing and so forth.

 Michelle:   I had a dream that was similar, when Sean. First passed away. He was transported to the hospital first.  So, we went there, and my whole family was called and they were there with us in the room. And then the doctors gave us the unfortunate news. And they asked us if we wanted to go in and say goodbye to Sean in the room where he was. And so, each of my family members, all went in there and I did. But after that, my whole family came back to my house. And we were all just sitting there, numb. And my father who's this tough former Marine started crying. And he said, when he went into the room to say goodbye to Sean, he heard Sean say it's okay, grandpa. I'm okay. Yeah. And so, he told me that, and I remember later on that night telling my husband, why didn't Sean say that to me? When I went in there? And I struggled with that. And later it came to me that, the way I do things in my own brain, I would have discounted it and found a way to disbelieve it. But my father, I knew there was no way he would make something like that. So, I felt like, almost felt like he got that message. So that I would believe it. And now, and you know, I don't, I don't necessarily believe that it was Sean communicating with him. I think it's God that gives us these glimpses of heaven. Yeah. 

 Mary:  Well, you have to remember the veil is just, it's just a veil into his kingdom, you know, but I do remember that when Nate, when they were trying to release him from being intubated, I mean, he only lasted maybe 10 minutes, but during that time he was able to mouth. I love you three times. Cause we were all with them. You know, my husband, his brothers and sisters, their significant others. So, it was a, you know, it was a beautiful. I mean, I'm glad I got that. Yeah. I mean, my heartbreaks, when parents lose a child due to an accident or not being able to say goodbye. Yeah. You know, we did get to at least say goodbye to Nate. Yeah. In a weird kind of a way. 

 Michelle:  No, that's a blessing. So, what lessons did you learn from this great loss that you can share with others to help them in their grief journey? 

Mary:   That control is an illusion.  That we only get this one life and we have to live it to the fullest because we don't know when that day of reckoning or that day of us being called home is going to happen. I try to be more spontaneous. I try to not find a fence or hold grudges. I know pictures are important, sometimes you'll might get intimidated to want to take people's pictures, but really that's, that's a good, that's what you have. You have your, the pictures that you can look back on as they are being raised, as they graduate high school, you know, whatever in that aspect, in the memory. I mean, I think part of it is people forget to talk about your loved one. They're afraid to, I don’t know if they're thinking that if they bring it up, it's going to cause you know, something or yeah.

But, but it's okay. Let people know that you're thinking of their departed one that, you think of Nate on certain days or if something sparks a memory or a smell or. You know, just remember that and share it because they're not gone. I mean, they're gone from physical, but they're not gone.  You got to remember, just remember. Don't forget, yeah. 

 Michelle:    I like that you said, don't be afraid to say their names because I think, I think you're right. That is an issue with people. And we got to give them grace because we didn't know how to handle this topic before our children died. But yeah. People tend to not want to mention. Their names. And I know at holiday get together and things like that, it would have been a blessing to me if we could have even had a seat at the table and set a special prayer or a memory or something that I, I needed that in the beginning, but I think everyone didn't know what I needed and was afraid to even go there because I don't want to make you upset again. Right. So hopefully that's something that we can pass along to somebody who's listening. Who, who wants to understand how to interact with somebody who's hurting, say their name, ask how they're doing., don't be afraid to ask if, if you know a griever, no matter how long it's been, it's okay to say, hey, how are, how are you doing after all these years? I’m sure it's still hard on you, right? Yeah. 

 Mary:  Well, especially dates. Dates will play a part birthday, anniversaries. You know, my biggest thing now is the, what ifs, if Nate was still alive, what would he be married? Would he have children? What do you still be working? in the tile business, the, what ifs, the things that we don't know will, you know, Things have been worse. We don't know, but we drive ourselves nuts asking these questions of why. 

 Michelle:  Yeah. Sean's birthday is coming up, on March 1st. Yeah. And so, I just saw one of his friends last nights who came to visit and she just had her birthday. So, we were talking about, you know, her being 25 and they look so different now they don't look at kids anymore. They're adults. And so, I have to entertain that thought of what would he look like now? You know, would he be married? Would he have kids? And yeah, it's hard. 

 Mary:  It is hard. Hmm. But I do know through faith and through. Just leaning, on God's graces, you get that peace and that peace stays with you. It doesn't leave., it's a piece that surpass. Oh understanding. Yeah. And I think the biggest thing is you need to just live, laugh and love. Enjoy life, enjoy life. Yeah.  Staying close to my family, staying close to my kids. Give yourself the time you need and you will get through it.  You don't think you will, or you don't think you want to, but you will get through it. 

 Michelle:  You know, everybody's struggling, everybody's got something and I just think to myself, how do people do it that don't have God.

 Mary: I don't want to find out.  

  Michelle:  Well, Mary, thank you so much for sharing Nate's story with us today and for all the wisdom and insight you gained, as you moved forward, following the loss of your dear son. And for those of you listening, it is our hope that you were inspired today by Mary's words. And if you are struggling with the loss of someone you love, please know that you too can find a place of peace and joy again in your life as you turn to God for you. And remember that one day you will be able to comfort someone else with the comfort that you've received. 

And as always, I appreciate your feedback. So, drop by my website callmequalified.com where you can listen to all the episodes and check out my blog and even rate the show and give me a review.

I'd love to hear from you. Thanks for listening.

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